SAC Bunt turns into E2?

[Rix]

Total noob here. Love the forums as a great resource, especially with so many willing to help.

Here's the scenario:

SAC Bunt. Catcher throws to first for E2.

Batter goes to 2nd. - Advances runner from 1st to 3rd.

Is this a case where the SAC turns into an E2 instead? So the batter went from going 0-0 to 0-1 if that were the case?

Thanks,

[BJWanlund]

Whoa, bizarre play.

I'd probably score that as just an attributed error to the catcher, and basically say no actual "sac bunt" but an attempted sac bunt because the catcher made an error in throwing to first, therefore the batter went to 2nd.

BJ

[Rix]

Not as bizarre as it sounds in girl's 12U softball!!!

It's quite common for a laid down bunt for advancing runners to turn into a mess in a hurry! A missed throw to 1st can turn into a run scored for the batter at times.

In this case, my daughter laid down the bunt and looks like she'll end up with a 0-fer on the at-bat, even though she did what she was supposed to. It was the first time I had to figure out how to score it and I wasn't sure if I was doing it right.

iScore actually looks like it did it right, once I could find the logic of how to score it.

Thanks for the feedback.

[OhioTex]

Also see the scenerio were the bater/runner on the sac bunt beats the throw to first, catcher throws late and compounds with wild, Score sac bunt now a bunt hit, and batter/ runner reaches second on E2 (or E3) on the throw/catch. for youth ball with short base distances, not uncommon, the value of putting ball in play and letting the defense shoot them self in the foot.

[danmcc]

How I would score it, FWIW.

in play
tap more
tap sac bunt w error
show location
tap catcher
tap third for runner advancing to third and tap error
tap catcher for who caused error
Next what happened to batter, tap second
tap error
tap catcher.

[CSThunderCoach]

You really need to wait for the initial play before you determine the scoring.

1) If the batter would have been out, you score it as a SacBunt w/Error. Runners advancing on the throw.

2) If the batter would have been safe, you score it as a bunt single. Runners advancing on the error.
If you leave this as a sac bunt with the error allowing the advance, the batter will not be credited with a hit. If the batter/runner beats out the sacrifice attempt it is no longer scored as a sacrifice and instead scored as a bunt single (with a note, of course. )

3) If the batter/runner is safe at first because of a Fielders Choice, the batter is no longer credited with a sac bunt.

iScoring:
1) In Play
More...
Sac Bunt with Error
Location and type (typical soft grounder)
tap Catcher
runner to Third (Held Up or Advanced by Batter)
batter/runner to Second (On the Throw)
This method correctly shows that the error occurred at 1st, and that the runner advanced to 3rd, and the batter/runner went to second on the throw.

2) In Play
Bunt
Location and type
runner to Third (Held Up)
runner to Second (Error on Catcher) (make note of the sacrifice attempt)
This method shows that the batter/runner is now on second due to an error on catcher and bunt single is recorded correctly for batting average.

3) In Play
Fielders choice
Location and type
2-6 or 2-4 or the sequence of players making the out.
runner at Second Out - Forced Out.
batter/runner at First - Held Up (make note of the SacBunt attempt)
iScore will not show this as a bunt attempt because they do not currently have this as an option with a fielders choice.

If you score #3 as:
In Play
Sac Bunt
Location and Type
Runner at second Out - Force Out
Touch players making out (2-6, 2-4)
Batter/Runner at first Held Up
The batter is still credited with a SacBunt - which is not the case - it was a fielders choice, and should impact the stats accordingly.

[HITCHCOCK5]

Really nice thread (discussion for u newbies). A perfect "read" for the post describing the need to watch CAREFULLY to see if batter would have been safe with a perfectly thrown ball.

Question: What is the usefulness of the notes you guys are writing? Where are these notes displayed other than the occasional look at "Pitch by Pitch"?

[CSThunderCoach]

I will go back and transfer all of the notes from the pitch-by-pitch to the printed scorebook. I guess I am just a freak about notes and stats. I will take scorebooks with me to tournaments and refer to them instead of trying to look through the play-by-play printouts. A good scorebook entry is worth a thousand words. And a couple of notes makes it worth a few more. )

[FTMSupport]

The notes are also available on the Play by Play in the Admin Website (Options->Admin Website) and on the iScoreCasts which people can watch live or as a replay.

We will be adding the notes to the Scorebooks in the future as well, so it is worth entering the notes now to have records as even more uses for them become available.

[OhioTex]

notes are a real value add to document all the secondary stuff.. WOW gold glove, Brain freeze, debatable error, Sun was in his eyes, great catch. my mom could have made that play.. Bad call, etc etc etc. notes are just flexible to do with what you want or not. so many odd plays can happen and this can explain them better.