Double play?
Double play?
Situation: Man on 1st with 1 out. Batter hits a grounder to first baseman who tags his base and gets the out on the batter. The first baseman then throws to to the shortstop who is covering 2nd base. The runner arrives before the throw and the umpire signals he is safe. The runner unfortunately does not slide and continues past the past at which time the shortstop tags him out. What is the best way to score this? Thanks
Re: Double play?
That's not a double play, IMO.
I'd score that as a ground out to the first baseman. Runner out at second, tagged out by SS. There's no assist on that out.
I'd score that as a ground out to the first baseman. Runner out at second, tagged out by SS. There's no assist on that out.
Re: Double play?
I think I'd score it as ground out to first baseman. Runner SAFE at second, advanced by batter. Then, I'd immediately tap the runner and score them as Out, Tagged by SS. I'd then put in a note that says the runner overran 2nd base.
Not sure there's anything different statistically, but that seems like a more accurate representation of what happened.
Not sure there's anything different statistically, but that seems like a more accurate representation of what happened.
Re: Double play?
That's actually how I ultimately scored it but I was on the fence about whether to call it a double play. It seems that breaking it into two parts and using the note feature is the only good way to reflect the mistake by the runner. Thanks
Re: Double play?
I think that is a double play...
10.11 DOUBLE AND TRIPLE PLAYS
The official scorer shall credit participation in a double play or triple play to each
fielder who earns a putout or an assist when two or three players are put out between the
time a pitch is delivered and the time the ball next becomes dead or is next in possession of
the pitcher in a pitching position, unless an error or misplay intervenes between putouts.
10.11 DOUBLE AND TRIPLE PLAYS
The official scorer shall credit participation in a double play or triple play to each
fielder who earns a putout or an assist when two or three players are put out between the
time a pitch is delivered and the time the ball next becomes dead or is next in possession of
the pitcher in a pitching position, unless an error or misplay intervenes between putouts.
Re: Double play?
I think I would categorize the overrun of second base as a "Misplay" by that rule.
Scenario: In fastpitch softball, suppose the runner was safe at second and the ball was thrown back to the pitcher in the circle, but she had not yet taken a pitching position. Further suppose that the runner at second faked a move to third before returning to the bag at second and the pitcher didn't make a move. The runner would be called out, but that certainly wouldn't be considered a double play, even though the ball is not dead nor is the pitcher in a pitching position.
I see the overrun of second as essentially the same thing. But that's just me. I'm certainly willing to be talked into another viewpoint.
Scenario: In fastpitch softball, suppose the runner was safe at second and the ball was thrown back to the pitcher in the circle, but she had not yet taken a pitching position. Further suppose that the runner at second faked a move to third before returning to the bag at second and the pitcher didn't make a move. The runner would be called out, but that certainly wouldn't be considered a double play, even though the ball is not dead nor is the pitcher in a pitching position.
I see the overrun of second as essentially the same thing. But that's just me. I'm certainly willing to be talked into another viewpoint.
Re: Double play?
I can see that interpretation. I wasn't thinking of a baserunning misplay, but it makes sense.
You could also say that he would not have beaten the tag if he had slid into the base instead of running through it. Maybe it should involve some scorekeeper judgement?
You could also say that he would not have beaten the tag if he had slid into the base instead of running through it. Maybe it should involve some scorekeeper judgement?
Re: Double play?
Actually, the misplay only applies to actions by the defense, not the offense.SnackShop wrote:I can see that interpretation. I wasn't thinking of a baserunning misplay, but it makes sense.
You could also say that he would not have beaten the tag if he had slid into the base instead of running through it. Maybe it should involve some scorekeeper judgement?
Because of continuous action, e.g., the first baseman's throw to the shortstop would qualify it as a double play (no penalty to the defense because the runner beat the tag play), 3-3-6
Here is a case where a misplay intervened that would negate a double play:
R1, none out. B2 grounds to SS, who steps on bag to retire R1, but the throw to first is wild. B2 attempts to advance to second, but the catcher, backing up the play, fires to second to retire B2. A double play is not credited because of the bad throw, but because of the putout at second base on B2, the throw is not charged as an error (6U on R1, FC and 3-6 on B2)