Dropped 3rd Strike subsequently picked off

[Angels coach]

1) BB, steals 2B on dropped 3rd (below)
2) K looking, dropped third strike (not a wild pitch). ADVANCES to 1B. Runner 1 goes to 2B.
3) ball - double steal attempt. runner 1 steals 3B. runner 2 (dropped 3rd runner) tries to steal 2B. Runner 2 Gets thrown out. runner 1 steals home on throw from C to 2B. Batter 3 gets walked.

How many "outs" and errors are their for the sake of scoring?

4) reaches on an error by SS.

IS this the 2nd or 3rd out ?

[Lorie]

My two cents.

First... unless there were already 2 out when the dropped 3rd strike happened, the batter is out because 1st was occupied. At the time of the pitch, the runner was on 1st... yes, he was attempting to steal, but he had yet to occupy 2nd base.

If there were 2 out, both runners are safe. The runner going to second would be 'defensive indifference' and the batter going to 1st would be reached on error (who gets the error depends on whether or not it was the catcher being unable to catch the ball or throw the ball to first to get the out or if the 1st baseman dropped the ball when it was thrown). On point 3... this is where 'judgement call' comes into play. I would score the runner going to 3rd as 'defensive indifference' because the defending team did not attempt to stop him. The runner going and thrown out at second would have to be your 3rd out and as such... the run only counts IF the runner touched home plate BEFORE the runner at 2nd was tagged out. If he did not touch home first... the run does not count.

Point 4 could not happen because there had to be 2 out already for the dropped 3rd strike batter to be safe at 1st.

If there were less than 2 out... the dropped 3rd strike batter is out and the rest of the scenario cannot happen and there should only be one runner on 2nd (as the ball is still live) and again, I would score that as 'defensive indifference' because no attempt was made to get the runner out.

I'm looking forward to other responses... it will be interesting to see the different ways scorekeepers would handle the situation.

[Angels coach]

My apologies. I was reconstructing this from memory. The first batter walked and then stole second. After he stole, the dropped third occurred. However, he stayed on 2B during the dropped third. Then the double steal pick off.

[PetroGuy]

Based on your revision, the only question appears to be how to score the double steal attempt. The only error I see for sure is batter 4 reaching on the error by the SS. The dropped third is a passed ball since you stated it was not a wild pitch. It might be an error depending on the throw by the catcher or the catch by the first baseman.

With regards to the double steal, here is the relevant MLB rule (most other rule sets are similar):
9.07 (d):

When a double- or triple-steal is attempted and one runner is
thrown out before reaching and holding the base such runner is
attempting to steal, no other runner shall be credited with a
stolen base.

So the runner starting on second does not get a steal since the runner on first was put out. The runner going to third and then home is a fielder's choice. In iScore, I would score it as 'On the Throw'.

[team mom]

PetroGuy - that was my interpretaion as well. The only caveat may be that the advance to home was a stolen base. The advance to third was definitely fielder's choice (or on the throw) since they went for the runner stealing to second and got the out. An argument may be made that the second base advance (from third to home) was in fact a steal. Maybe runner did not decide to steal home until assessing where the defense was after arriving safely at third. When runners try to stretch a single or double to more bases and get out on a tag, it does not take away from their hit. Not sure if this logic is sound, but taking the extra base seems like opportunistic base running.

[PetroGuy]

PetroGuy - that was my interpretaion as well. The only caveat may be that the advance to home was a stolen base. The advance to third was definitely fielder's choice (or on the throw) since they went for the runner stealing to second and got the out. An argument may be made that the second base advance (from third to home) was in fact a steal. Maybe runner did not decide to steal home until assessing where the defense was after arriving safely at third. When runners try to stretch a single or double to more bases and get out on a tag, it does not take away from their hit. Not sure if this logic is sound, but taking the extra base seems like opportunistic base running.

True. The third to home advance could be a steal depending on the sequence.

[Angels coach]

So my question is for ERA purposes is the error by SS THE third "out." Notice one batter/runner was out twice. He was "out" on the dropped third strike. Then he was out again a few pitches later on the double steal. So was the error by SS after that the end of any "earned" runs?

[PetroGuy]

tl;dr version - Batter 2 (dropped third batter) would not have been earned if they scored. The run (batter 1) that scored is earned. Batter 3 is the pitcher's responsibility. Batter 4 is not.

Full Explanation - A dropped third strike where the batter reaches first safely is also either a wild pitch or a passed ball. You said it was not a wild pitch so it is considered a passed ball. A batter who reaches due to a passed ball (or a runner who advances) does not count against the pitcher as an earned run (similar to an error) if they score.

In your situation, it appears the E6 would be counted as the second out in a reconstructed inning. The dropped third/passed ball would be out number one. The caught stealing would not be out two since it was for the same batter/runner would would already have been out. It is a judgement call on whether or not the runner going to third would have been out on the same caught stealing. Why did the catcher throw to second instead of third? No chance at that runner? Late jump by runner on first? So unless you have a clear judgement that the runner stealing third would have been out on the steal attempt (and I would give the benefit of the doubt to the runner), then that runner is still the pitcher's. Even if the runner didn't score on the throw to second, you would reconstruct the inning such that they would score on the ground out to SS. Again, that is a judgement call, but I would still give the benefit of the doubt to the runner unless there is something clear to indicate otherwise. The short answer is runner 1 is an earned run.